Australian Judge Endorses Incest

The dominoes of heteronormativity are falling. Many of my leftist friends (yes, I have a few) accused me of the slippery slope fallacy when I told them the normalization of homosexuality would lead to the eventual acceptance of other “formerly” aberrant sexual practices like pedophilia, bestiality, and incest. Well, sometimes what looks like a slippery slope fallacy is just an accurate prediction.

An Australian judge recently declared that our modern society had moved on past condemning incest between consenting adults. And his argument is perverse:

“A jury might find nothing untoward in the advance of a brother towards his sister once she had sexually matured, had sexual relationships with other men and was now ‘available,’ not having [a] sexual partner. . . . If this was the 1950s and you had a jury of 12 men there, which is what you’d invariably have, they would say it’s unnatural for a man to be interested in another man or a man being interested in a boy. Those things have gone.”

Judge Neilson made the comments during the trial of a brother charged with raping his younger sister. The man has pleaded guilty to sexually assaulting his sister when she was 10 or 11 years old in 1973 or 1974 but has pleaded not guilty to charges relating to sex they had in 1981, when she was 18 and he was 26.

“By that stage they are both mature adults,” the judge said. “The complainant has been sexually awoken, shall we say, by having two relationships with men and she had become ‘free’ when the second relationship broke down. The only thing that might change that is the fact that they were a brother and sister but we’ve come a long way from the 1950s—when the position of the English Common Law was that sex outside marriage was not lawful.”

But his argument is also logical. And this is what my leftist friends don’t want to accept. Notice the train of the judge’s argument: sex outside of marriage was once illegal, then it was homosexuality, then pedophilia… Why not incest? Really, why not? Favoring one sexual aberrancy over another is arbitrary, and it is peculiarly hypocritical.

Christians have a moral argument against sexual aberrancy. People don’t agree with our standard, but at least we have one. And it doesn’t change to suit the particular passing fetishes of decadent societies. But once you reject the possibility of objective law, there is really no option but to let everything, and anything, go.

260 responses

  1. God help us all who still are in control of our senses! This Australian judge should be immediately removed from the bench without question. Anyone who thinks that incest is harmless between two consenting adults is completely possessed. These degenerates won’t stop till every sin in creation becomes a normality.

    • “Anyone who thinks that incest is harmless between two consenting adults is completely possessed.”

      From what I’ve read the Rothschild favor incest.

    • Read my elaborate comment 11 hours LATER… Judges here are not political appointees, and cannot be removed, unless someone shoots them dead. He was merely following the LAW that people VOTED for in South Australian State pols. Yes – that State is CURSED of it’s own making… (being the poorest state per capita) – BUT YOUR COUNTRY IS HEADING THE SAME DIRECTION by voting for EVIL, as a result of DEMOCRATIC REPUBLICANISM (which God will replace with a MONARCHY by DEITY… being far more stable than any man-made government)… So, do not be too hypocritical, please….

      • Are you insane, or is all Australia insane? One or the other. If Australians voted, as you say, to allow men to rape any sexually mature woman in their home, then the Australian people truly deserve what they get. I suspect, however that you are an ignoramus, as indicated by your means of expressing yourself.

      • I wasn’t being critical of all your people, just this judge which is clearly defined in my post. I wasn’t aware that people in your country actually voted for this in your State pols, incredible as that seems. Insofar as my country heading in the same direction, you’re right, and so is almost every other country on this planet. How you thought I was being hypocritical is beyond me. Obviously you’ve never read my comments about the state of my own country. I’m afraid you were being a wee bit too sensitive.

    • And how does this “judge” rule that all sex is consensual if the principles are of age? The girl was raped by her brother. Because she was no longer a virgin (which he had taken care of when she was a child, by raping her) this man concludes that she is fair game to be raped by members of her family in what is supposed to be the safety of her home? This is so perverted that I can’t see how any words can sufficiently condemn this “judge”. Between him and the rapist, “judge” Nielson is by far the more dangerous criminal.

      • This is becoming commonplace in this country. People are literally getting away with murder these days. The way I see it, about the only thing that has now become a crime is to be a conservative Christian, and to oppose homosexuality.

        • So…as far as you are concerned, when a child is raped, there is no long-ranging sequelae of emotional inury linked to the attack and her attacker? This young woman is obviously confused since her attacker is her brother, and will no doubt have long-lasting issues which now have been exacerbated by this immoral judge, who has compounded her abuse.

          After all, in your godless world, this woman should just deal with the fact that humans are little more than animals with uncontrollable libidos, creatures driven by their DNA, and like dogs, should be able to screw their sisters…or their mothers…for that matter.

          • Judges should think beyond the case. Let’s assume that there was no sexual abuse in the past. One night, they just decided to do each other. Where is the harm?

            Incest was made illegal because the offspring were unfit, and invariably became wards of the state (or Alabamans). If abortion solves that problem, why not? ‘Cuz it makes your widdle baby Jesus cwy?

            Minors can’t legally consent to sexual intercourse, and neither can sheep in Wyoming. But a brother and sister in their 20s?

            I loathe telling other people what to do or how to live their lives, as long as it doesn’t affect mine. If you want to bow to a psychotic Bronze Age sky-daddy, what is it to me? If you want to do your brother, what is it to me?

          • “Incest was made illegal because the offspring were unfit, and invariably became wards of the state (or Alabamans).”…OR LIBTARDS, rather.

            So, you “loathe telling other people what to do or how to live their lives,” and yet you continue to do so. In fact, that’s all libtards ever do. In case you want to say you are “libertarian”, let me spell it out for you. The time of obfuscation is past. Decent Americans have identified the lie that is the libertarian perspective. Libertarians ARE liberals, there is no difference, which is why you allied yourselves to install McAuliffe in VA.

          • “Cuz it makes your widdle baby Jesus cwy?” do you have any idea what you just did? You have taken the LORD’s name in vain! I realize you don’t care, but, hang in there, you will answer for that smart-aleck remark…

    • No, they won’t sadly, and not until they’re “tolerated” and enacted in every church as well!

      • It’s like a living nightmare. Makes you wonder just how many people really do believe in God and judgment.

        • Sin, judgment, repentance, and refemption are no longrr taught in churches. In most cases, the Holy Spirit lef decades ago, and they don’t even realize that! In Mt 24, Jesus Himself warned about believing in “different Jesus'” and “different spirits”; His warning’s veracity was shown to be accurate still in the 1st century. Look at how often the letters speak against OTHER teachings already creeping in. Fast-forward 20 centuries, and look at the state of our world, as compared to Noah’s times. I know you know what happened back then, and I’ll bet you know too what God promised for the next time. Time to invest in heavy -duty “flame repellant” suits! Sadly, many who truly believe temselves saved, based on what they’re taught in today’s churches that are so “Christianly” embracing sinners into their bosoms, are going to be greatly surprised to learn that was never God’s instruction! More, since justice was never sawyrtisfied (by true repentance), mercy cannot and will not (in the form of salvation by redemption) be extended either.

    • Even if we were to take religious beliefs out of consideration, the powerful emotional influence that older family members have on younger ones negates all possibility of true consent. Ignorance of this common dynamic creates victims. If we say such behavior is acceptable, we are complicit.

      • According to the poster who is from Australia, people literally voted for this which is why the judge was “merely following the law.” Unbelievable, but according to this Aussie, absolutely true.

    • He must be a product of incest. Also, polygamy is going to be tolerated if trends continue. Both Mormons and Muslims practice polygamy in the USA and libs will say it is racist to oppose Muslims practicing polygamy.

  2. Study the case of Muslims most of whom marry 1st cousins, or even uncles marrying nieces is not unknown. A case study in Denmark of Muslim families there reveals that incest is common among immediate family members. Now look at the rate of birth defects among Muslims. The highest in the world. Even in UK, where so many Muslims have migrated. In tribal culture, which still prevails in Islamic countries it was customary to distrust anyone outside the extended family. I’m disgusted by the notion of having sex with my relatives. This judge should be run out of town on a rail.

  3. While incest is heterosexual, it continues to be perversion, and parents must continue to teach their babies and children that is is not done. One wonders if the judge in subject is guilty of the same, or if he covets the male anus, and is a pedophile. Come a long way since the 1950s ? Yes, on the wrong road.

  4. We’re doomed people! Doomed! The last days are upon us. The world is becoming Sodom. And you know how God dealt with it. If not, look it up in Gen. 19:24

    • Remember…the Christian has nothing to fear. Though the wicked will wax more wicked and Satan will pull out all the stops because his time is short, we are safe in Christ. John 16:33.

      Php 1:21 For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.

        • “…and no reason to interfere?”

          What do you mean by that? Are we not supposed to call evil evil? Are we not supposed to call sin sin? Are we not supposed to proclaim righteousness and teach the Truth of the Word of God to those who are perishing?

          • Yes, John we are. Unfortunately, those on the Left, although they have ears, they do not hear. The results of Obama winning another election is proof of that.

          • Your Bible tells us that your god wanted it that way. Rom. 13:1-7. He hand-picked Nero and Hitler….

          • If Rom 13:1 is true….and I believe it is…..then it would seem that a Christ-rejecting, infanticidal Nation, has gotten the president it deserves. We have been sold into captivity to crime, drugs and evil leaders. In the past, many times God used wicked despots to judge His own people Israel by allowing them to become captive of their enemies, until they repented of their rebellion and cried out to Him. Such is God’s judgment on America today.

          • Then we can blame the Holocaust on your god and his fair-haired boy with the funny ‘stache? Fair enough. As your god blessed an act of genocide, Jos. 6, all little Adolf did was follow the sterling example of His Fuhrer Who Art in Himmel.

          • You can say whatever you want … but increasingly, no one is buying the snake oil you are selling.

            This decision will liberate rednecks everywhere.

          • You are either a troll who imagines themselves as “clever,” or a blind fool. What we are “selling” is civilization and sanity, and those who aren’t “buying” are choosing anarchy and chaos. Increasing, people are rejecting civilization, freedom, and the rule of law, and increasingly the world is falling into chaos, despair, and death.

            The United States in spiraling out of control, and is beyond the state of decline. Do not bother me with mindless partisan rhetoric, because both parties are ruled by power-mongering idiots, who could care less about the future of this nation. And, it is precisely because people have chosen to be ruled by the whims of men that, increasingly, people are buying the “promises” of despotic politicians, and are rejecting the rule of law, and the Biblical principles that made this country great.

            Power-mad presidents, congressmen, and justices have only screwed things up, because it’s been the PEOPLE of this country. and the freedom and liberty that it afforded that made America the greatest country that ever existed. When people are allowed to be creative, free-spoken and thinking, and entrepreneurial, then the country as a whole prospers in every way possible. So, when you convince everyone that they need politicians and their “promises,” we turn into being no different than anyplace else.

          • What you are “selling” is theocracy, not unlike the madcap mullahs of Tehran. America isn’t the greatest country in the world, except in the bubble of your mindless propaganda. Freedom and the rule of law precipitate a lot of things you do not like, including same-sex marriage, abortion, and premarital sex.

          • You shamelessly mirror Obama’s view of America and like all leftists, you spit in her face.

            Unlike an Islamic theocracy which would seek to control every aspect of your life from waking to bedtime, America was founded on the Judeo/Christian ethic…..for which you have so much contempt. It is governed by a Constitution which was wisely and prayerfully constructed to allow all men….even those who reject God……to exercise all of the God-given blessings bestowed on the country.

            The licentious world that you are working to supplant traditional American culture with will be hell on earth.

          • Any government grounded in Matt. 7:12–“in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets”–will be both benign and beneficial. As long as you don’t hurt anyone else in the process, I don’t care overmuch as to what you do. But I have learned the lessons of history.

            If you object to an Islamic theocracy–and you should–you should also fear a Christian theocracy. Our Constitution was superb for its day, but it has a number of serious and latent flaws. I’m an originalist, having exactly no time for a “living Constitution,” but I recognize that this one has just about reached the end of its useful life.

            If the future of America is Australia, then our future is pretty bright. Let us welcome change.

          • You mean, like “[s]o in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets”? Matt. 7:12. There is a governing biblical principle: A persistent bias toward individual liberty.

            You want to tell others what to do. That is theocracy. I want to refrain from doing so, because I don’t want others to tell me what to do. The government should not restrain people; people should restrain themselves.

          • People can be gay all they want. Just dont re invent the wheel with marriage. And dont murder the most innocent. Aka unborn children, regardless of circumstance.

          • Abortion is a practical solution for an imperfect world. 93% of women who know that they have Down pregnancies abort, and who am I to question that?

          • Ok so slavery was ok? It didnt effect those against it, yet it was fought against. Same with abortion. Its to save lives, no matter how it was conceived. Because that child is innocent inthe end.

          • We probably didn’t need a war to end it. Mexico did away with slavery in 1810. China abolished it in 1368, and Japan, in 1590. What took you Christians so long?

          • Guess I must have missed the point you were trying to make. Slavery wasn’t fought against, in the sense that other countries were WAY ahead of you. But Christians have that all-purpose slavery manual, the Bible, to guide them on the management of slaves….

          • My point was pretty simple. Slavery was fought against in this country (when doesn’t matter, the fact is it happened). And those that fought against it, didn’t own slaves, so it didn’t involve them. So from your stance on for example, “don’t like abortion don’t have one” or “don’t like gay marriage, don’t marry a gay person”, then your reasoning for slavery would be, “don’t like slavery, don’t own a slave.” See the point now? I fight against abortion because it is just wrong on every level. Your reasoning and justification and assume desire for abortions to end down syndrome and other defects and illness, is just deeply disturbing. I wonder honestly if you have a heart at all.

          • I fight you ChristiaNazi Taliban on this point because you have no practical solution. You miserable SOBs bleed for the fetus, but when that little urchin pops out, you have no qualms about letting it go hungry. You are more about slut-shaming than caring about people, and THAT is just wrong on every level.

            My reasoning is that if you don’t pay the freight, you don’t have a say. It is tough enough to make it in your world of extreme Darwinism with all your faculties; it is often better for the family as a whole for the putative mother to abort the Down fetus. Blame it on your psychotic ancient tribal sky-daddy, who could make every child a healthy one.

          • And yet you STILL dodge the point completely! We fight for lives that don’t involve us! I DO believe in helping those that need help (actually need it, not lazy parents and out of wedlock sleep-around’ers). And FORCING us to give our money for those you claim need it, is wrong in itself.

            Btw, you claim we are the Nazi’s? Who were the ones claiming to rid the world of imperfections for perfection? Uh, the Nazi’s. So your desire to rid the world of human imperfections before they are born, you are the one that sounds far more Nazi-like.

          • B21: “I DO believe in helping those that need help (actually need it, not lazy parents and out of wedlock sleep-around’ers).

            As I said, it’s all about slut-shaming for you ChristiaNazi Taliban. No sex out of wedlock because your psychotic god said so. You’d be more credible if you cared about the little critters once they hatched.

            B21: “And FORCING us to give our money for those you claim need it, is wrong in itself.

            The reason we have a social safety-net is because we KNOW that ChristiaNazi pond-scum can be expected to act like ChristiaNazi pond-scum.

            B21: “Btw, you claim we are the Nazi’s?

            Yep. A Down child is an enormous burden on a family, and not everyone is able to afford it. It’s not fair to the other kids, because resources will have to be diverted. And we know that YOU can’t be counted on to chip in. Furthermore, there is no such thing as a perfectly safe, 100% effective, and reasonably practical method of contraception. Why should a married couple have to refrain from sexual relations just to avoid an accident? Or engage exclusively in sodomy?

            You are, of course, aware of the rabbinical view that the soul enters the body at the first breath, are you not? If the body is not what we are, then abortion is not necessarily murder.

            Why can’t you leave the decision where it belongs — with the one who has to bear the burden? As a rule, women don’t abort lightly. If you’re not willing to pay the freight — and you have said that you are not! — there is no moral argument that can be made for your right to force your sick religious beliefs on others.

            You are as despicable as the Taliban.

          • Ok, just wanted to see if you’d admit that a person’s worth is based solely on what they can contribute to society, not the fact that s/he is a fellow human being. No matter what situation a woman finds herself in, murdering her child should never be an option. If her toddler was in a car accident and became a burden on the family because of the injuries, I guess you’d be ok with her shooting the child. Good to know where you stand. And as far as the breath/soul thing goes, that’s not Biblical. Just because a group of ppl decided that, doesn’t mean it’s the truth. Adam and Eve were not created in a womb, so they had to start breathing air to begin living. An embryo is living right at its conception.

          • The breath-soul thing is VERY Biblical. “Then the Lord God formed a man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being.” Gen. 2:7.

            B21: “No matter what situation a woman finds herself in, murdering her child should never be an option.

            But aborting a fetus ought to be. Remember, if you can convince every woman in the country to think like you, there would be no abortion, even if it were legal. Reasonable people disagree on this, and you have no right to force your view on others, whwen you won’t even spring for SNAP funds.

            B21: “An embryo is living right at its conception.

            Do you have a daughter of child-bearing age? If so, can I grab her off the street and forcibly impregnate her with a snowflake baby? A yes or no answer will do.

            No rights are absolute.

          • Truth is an absolute, not relative. And if you raped my daughter and she became pregnant, I would pray she wouldn’t murder the baby.

          • Not at all, and you are delusional if you actually “think” that. Muslims have something called “shariah,” but I hold to our constitution, the essence of which only affords freedom and liberty to the average citizen, and places clear limits upon what the federal government does. Today, these limits are being completely ignored, and the country suffers for it.

            Regarding mindless propaganda, you obviously missed where I said that the US is spiraling out of control, and is obviously declining, and that the principles that MADE (past tense) America so great are no longer under consideration anymore. It’s kind of weird, though, that so many people want to leave their countries of birth to come here. Read Alexis de Tocqueville sometime.

            Regarding same-sex marriage, I don’t care what gays and lesbians do, just so long as it doesn’t infringe upon MY rights, or the rights of others. Religiously, homosexuality is wrong to most people, and people ought to be able to refuse service within the context of celebrating that which is a sexual deviation, including performing such marriage and providing catering to it. If homosexuals demand to be married by the pastor of my church, within the sanctuary of it, then they are attempting to infringe upon our first amendment rights. If they wish to go somewhere that approves of marrying them, then that’s just dandy with me, just so long as I do not have to be made a party to it.

            Regarding abortion, one of our original unalienable rights is LIFE, and unborn babies are human beings, hence they are afforded the right to LIVE. Freedom to kill infants is butchery, not liberty. And, as I have stated before, science and medicine is on the right-to-life side of the argument, while the “pro-choice” arguments are subjective and arbitrary (indeed, their side takes more of an air of religious creed than you’d imagine).

            Regarding premarital sex, I do not see anyone calling for stiff punishments for having such sexual encounters, unless, of course, we’re talking about Muslims, who DO such things as “honor killing,” and the like. So, this issue is nothing more than a strawman.

          • You want to impose your form of Shari’a upon the rest of us, such as when it comes to SSM, abortion, and other hobby horses. There is little difference, except that there are so few of you here. Most Americans have little time for extremists of any stripe.

            JB: ‘Religiously, homosexuality is wrong to most people, and people ought to be able to refuse service within the context of celebrating that which is a sexual deviation, including performing such marriage and providing catering to it.

            State legislatures in Colorado and New Mexico respectfully disagree, and they have the lawful power to regulate commerce. If they pass a law governing who a business open to the public must serve, they have every right to do so, and if you want to stay in business, you have to follow the law.

            JB: “Regarding abortion, one of our original unalienable rights is LIFE, and unborn babies are human beings, hence they are afforded the right to LIVE.

            That is your personal (and almost certainly, Talibani religious) conviction, but the Constitution, properly interpreted, respectfully disagrees. The right to life only extends to those who have been born, which makes sense if you consider the alternative. How would you like it if we accosted your wife on the street and forcibly impregnated her with a “snowflake baby”? If a zygote has an absolute right to life, then that right trumps your wife’s.

            No right is absolute. As Justice Frankfurter famously said, “your freedom to swing your fist ends at the end of my nose.” The putative mother’s rights have to be considered, a part of the equation that the Christian Taliban conveniently overlooks. The current law has the wisdom of Solomon, in the sense that the mother’s rights diminish and are ultimately waived by failure to exercise them, whereas the fetus’s rights “grow” as it does. It is a practical solution for an imperfect world. How that constitutes a religious belief is not at all clear.

            While it may offend you, 93% of women faced with a Down pregnancy choose to abort. You’re not carrying the freight, and you shouldn’t have a say. Slut-shaming is what our Christian Taliban is all about.

            Have you ever been to Central America? Ever been outside of the tourist zones of Cancun and Cabo? If you have, it is easy to see why they want to come here, but if you compare it to much of the Commonwealth, ours is not the best of all possible countries.

          • Wow…talk about mindless propaganda. You line up straw men and knock them over like a champ.

            Regarding abortion, limits were set into place BY Roe v. Wade, but they have been ignored. The United States is the most radically pro-abortion country on the face of the earth. All other countries that allow abortions set limits, but here a baby can be born by a botched abortion, and then left to die or actively killed. ANY suggestion that abortion be regulated and controlled (like any OTHER industry) is met by the pagan Taliban with howls and shrieks. It amazes me that progressives blame “deregulation” for all of our ills and evils, but they hypocritically equate regulating the abortion industry as “unconstitutional.”

            Your suggestion that “the fetus’ rights grow” is utter nonsense in the current American abortion culture. The pagan Taliban that rules the abortion issue in the United States is absolute in that a child may be killed even upon the day of their natural birth. Ordinarily, you progressives want America to be like everywhere else, except in regard to abortion, where we are exceptionally radical in our definition of “human” and who should be afforded rights.

            Moreover, if abortion is a “personal matter,” then it should be something that the individual should HAVE to plan for and consider prior to their pregnancy. Why should employers be forced to pay for it, if it is a “personal matter.” Why should people be forced to embrace that which they see as abhorrent? Where does this right to abort end when it encroaches upon the constitutional rights of others? If I have no say as to what a woman does with her body, then it ought to be HER RESPONSIBILITY to do what she wishes to do with her body. If I am supposed to pay for her abortion with my taxes, then I OUGHT to have say as to whether it follows certain standards and regulations. To grant the pagan Taliban infinite power over everyone in this matter is tyranny–the very tyranny that you predispose upon me.

            Now, about the pagan Taliban’s tyranny in order to force people to be made a party with deviant lifestyles…wow! One can take this in SO many directions, but really your examples of legislation are only made because they have (thus far) effected people of Christian faith and conscious. How about I make another example? Should a business like the bakeries that have refused to cater to homosexual weddings also have to cater to pederasts, or hate groups, or people who mock and insult them? Do they lose all rights of conscious when they form a business? How about if a business run by an atheist is told that they have to print signs for someone that denigrates atheists, and spreads hatred towards them? Or a Black business-owner that is told to cater to a KKK group?

            Obviously, the entire “issue” is aimed at Christians alone, because nobody would EVER offend Muslims, and if they did, they would have CAIR at their throats in record time. You are totally in agreement with pagan Talibani tyranny, so long as it does not offend anyone else. If someone offended another due to race, there would be parades of people protesting it. The same for any other Balkanized group who feel that they aren’t being properly respected. But, when it comes to Christians, it’s okay to trample all over OUR sensitivities, because it’s “snake oil,” right?

            And, who’s swallowing the propaganda here? Who is declaring absolute right of one to push their fist into another’s face? It seems to me that the issues of abortion and SSM ARE absolute, at least insofar as the fist can be specifically aimed at Christian’s faces. But regardless, you seem rather content to site laws that insist upon absolute right of one party over another when it suits you, but decry it when it isn’t politically expedient. Really, which side is behaving like Nazis here, when the state can declare that everyone must bury our individual conscious, and collectively embrace what it dictates?

          • Your fact-free assertions regarding abortion are ludicrous, and undeserving of my direct attention.

            JB: “Why should employers be forced to pay for it, if it is a “personal matter.”

            In point of fact, they don’t. Health care subsidies are part of your compensation package. Frankly, it’s none of the employer’s damn business.

            JB: “Should a business like the bakeries that have refused to cater to homosexual weddings also have to cater to pederasts, or hate groups, or people who mock and insult them? Do they lose all rights of conscious when they form a business?

            You religious droolers refused to rent out hotel rooms to dirty N******s. Laws were passed to force you to do so. State laws were passed saying that you could not discriminate against gays. The same rules apply. You always have the option of going out of business and becoming a Wal-Mart greeter.

            JB: “But, when it comes to Christians, it’s okay to trample all over OUR sensitivities, because it’s “snake oil,” right?

            It is snake oil, but that is beside the point. Laws of general application are not subject to a religious veto. That’s not me talking; that is Scalia. I have his home mailing address, if you want to discuss it personally.

            JB: “It seems to me that the issues of abortion and SSM ARE absolute, at least insofar as the fist can be specifically aimed at Christian’s faces

            What happens in the uterus down the street is really none of your business, and unless and until you can present a coherent argument as to why same-sex couples should not be allowed to marry–in 30-plus court cases, no one has–you have to deal with the fact that their right to contract is every bit as valid as yours is. These are neutral principles of constitutional law, and if you don’t like the outcome, it is not my problem.

          • “What happens in the uterus down the street is really none of your business” Does that mean you agree no one, no employer, no insurance company, no government, should pay for anything dealing with said uterus except the owner? Unless of course it was cancer or something actually related to health.

          • Health insurance is part of your compensation package, and neither you nor the owner’s employer ought to have squatter’s rights over that uterus. When you put in a day’s work, that money is yours.

          • You know, there is one thing that I can determine from your posts as a whole. You would prefer the first amendment say freedom from religion, rather than freedom of religion. It is rare to see such intense focused hatred for such things. But then again, you are old as you say, so being bitter tends to be a trait.

          • Freedom of religion means freedom from others forcing their religion on you. That is at the core of the Baptist tradition, which is why the Danbury Baptists asked Thomas Jefferson about it.

          • All of your ugly, hateful presuppositions regarding Christians are ludicrous, and are unworthy of comment. You’ve already blamed us for the destruction of the entire earth, regardless of the fact that you have NO evidence for human-caused “global warming.” Gore’s movie was propaganda, the entire thrust to stop the United States from surviving economically is propaganda, and only partisans like yourself are lapping it up.

            If abortion is a personal “right” (that I have no say in) then let the people who get them PAY FOR THEM. Nobody else should be responsible for what someone does with their bodies. The fact of the matter is that many, if not most abortions are federally subsidized, and that shouldn’t be. There is not a single right spoken of in our constitution that costs a single dime, so why should it in this case?

            SIGH…when have I said that homosexuals cannot marry? I don’t care what they do, so long as they do not carry their so-called “right” to do so into my right of faith and conscious. Once you’ve forced people to do and say what the esteemed authorities have dictated, then you’ve completely scrapped the first amendment, and IT is the linchpin of the entire Bill of Rights. Forcing anyone to do anything that they are not inclined to do is tyranny. Put the shoe on your foot, and imagine atheists being told that they must cater to events that go against their conscious principles. Or, what about if a Muslim shop is told that they want decorations that they find abhorrent to their beliefs? Do you really believe that any court in the land would force Muslims to thrown away what they believe, because a customer told them to? (BTW, homosexuality is officially a no-no in the religion of Islam)

          • I blame religious nutters in general and their propensity for over-breeding. The turning point in the fate of the planet was the selection of GWBush; back then, we still had time to head off what is now a date with disaster. I can see no realistic hope for the biosphere at this point.

            JB: “ you have NO evidence for human-caused “global warming.”

            I can remember when paid scientific whorrrrres said that smoking cigs didn’t cause cancer. Perhaps you can tell that to this guy: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/richard-muller-koch-brothers-funded-scientist-declares-global-warming-real-article-1.969870 He was a Koch Sucker, taking cash from the plutocratic brothers, who got religion.

            JB: “If abortion is a personal “right” (that I have no say in) then let the people who get them PAY FOR THEM.

            They do. You are not pregnant until the egg implants in the uterine wall, and abortifacients like Plan B only induce an artificial menstrual period. Personally, I am in favor of paying for abortions for women on welfare, as it is cheaper than raising a child on the public dole.

            JB: “ Put the shoe on your foot, and imagine atheists being told that they must cater to events that go against their conscious principles.

            Christian money spends every bit as well as atheist money. The problem is?

            JB: “Or, what about if a Muslim shop is told that they want decorations that they find abhorrent to their beliefs?

            The law is the law, applying to everyone equally, and until recently, there was no religious veto.

            Islam is Christianity with different mullahs.

          • Jesus said that when He returned, ”the faith” would hardly be found. As prophesied by the Apostle Paul, the anti-God delusion that you reflect has affected many. In the end, few will believe in their Creator and the culmination of the age will not be pretty for them.

          • By any objective measure (the Olivet Discourse), Jesus missed his curtain call over 1900 years ago.

      • You’re right, meeme, although life on this planet is becoming something similar to the twilight zone. Incredible how a country can be torn down so fast in just five years.

        • patriotusa2, gtcu. Just ten years ago, I never would have believed that such a drastic change over such a short period of time was possible. I used to wonder how a people could ever be so stupid as to let themselves be overcome by a despot……..but sadly, now I know.

          • Yes, and it’s very sad to see a country that many of us still love, be deliberately destroyed.

    • Not to mention everything else going on, Israel in trouble again, Ovomit’s stupidity and purposely killing America, illegals coming in by the droves carrying God only knows what………………. I am sad for the kids growing up today in this big beautiful blue marble that God made and man has destroyed it…..

      • Global warming. For all practical intents and purposes, Man has destroyed the biosphere, and it won’t matter overmuch in another 200-300 years.

  5. Once again liberalism tries to justify a totally sick and disgusting act. To liberals nothing is wrong unless it pertains to them directly. As long as they are the do’er instead of the do’ee it’s perfectly okay. In my eyes liberalism is a sickness of the mind that justifies all that is morally wrong to gratify a personal need. In the same sense the use the term freedom of choice to justify their immorality.

    • You must understand what the Left values above all else: their sex. The big O. No matter what else happens, NEVER get between a Leftist & his or her current object of lust, whether that be human, animal, mineral or vegetable. They kill for sex. They actually literally worship it. Their lusts are EVERYTHING to them. If they say they want more money, for example, it’s ultimately really about impressing their object of desire–which, in the end, is really their own orgasms.

      Disgusting? Of course it is. Sin always is. It leaves a person hooked on his or her own lust. Be very careful when dealing with such people. BEST is to avoid them if possible, but never go unarmed: wear the armor of God. Pray YOU can resist temptation, as well as that they may have their eyes opened & repent.

      We only have a few short years left (since ALL the prophecies are happening right on schedule). Protect your soul, because while God will protect your soul, it doesn’t mean your BODY will get through the coming days without a lot of pain & misery. Just remember your true goal! Look up! When He returns, you won’t have to wonder if He’s really the true One. EVERYONE on Earth will know =instantly,= & either cheerfully greet Him, or fall to their knees in bitter surprise to discover He IS real, & now they get to PAY for the sins they unrepentantly committed.

      • I agree with you to a point and even then I side strongly with you on that. The point being the second coming. Even though mans signs may point to the time no one shall know it. I could go into a great diatribe why I feel this way but I feel that you understand my meaning.
        Since we are all sinners we must be prepared I agree with you highly. Since the beginning God has given us the vision of choice. Many times he has warned us. Yet there are those of free thinking that will deny the truth and consider themselves God like. It will be too their downfall, their pitfall into eternity because no one will escape judgement. I honestly feel sorry for these people because they will never know the kingdom that awaits.

        • Yes, the Scriptures clearly tell us we’ll see certain signs that herald the End, though the exact day & time isn’t told to us.

          As far as anyone Christian is concerned, however, we want to live for Christ as if EVERY day might be OUR last, no matter what the world is doing, because, with a handful of exceptions, ALL of us WILL DIE, so we each have OUR “end days.”

          Besides, life lived lovingly with your soul aligned with God’s will is just flat BETTER! Only in Heaven will it be perfect, but think how much we gain by living under His protective wings!

          • Signs can often lull us into a false sense of judgement. Throughout history many have observed the so called end signs and yes that could be a good thing. If we are prepared and our hearts and minds are aligned we will see the Kingdom of God. If not we will be judged and cast into the fiery abyss.
            Myself I’m a sinner trying to live and walk the devout path. As any human my faults sometimes outweigh my favors. In away we are all like that and have to maintain a careful watch upon ourselves.
            Remember the pathway into eternity has many diversions ,detours and signs. To reach you final goal you must maintain your moral compass and keep strong to your faith.

  6. If for no other reason, it should not be, look at the product of such close genetic reproduction, the Egyptians married their brothers and sisters and they developed all sorts of genetic abnormalities, bad for the species, including disgust.

  7. All these sexual perversions are not accepted at all. It is because within the ranks of our governments which has been infiltrated by these leftest freaks allowing these things to happen legally! There are way more moral people out here than the perverted ones in political offices.The select few are corrupting the morals of minor children in schools and removing religion which got in their way! We must take a stand in the name of God to stop the Devil’s reach upon our world and our country. We have to save the children’s and our souls. We will be mocked and ridiculed along the way, but we do out number the immoral and corrupted at least a hundred to one! We must stop them and save mankind! Or God will destroy us all!

  8. The gradual take over of government by criminal perverts is inevitable when people refuse to take an active hand in government. Most people just want to party, and worry about themselves, while leaving that pesky government stuff to those motivated to seek office. That would be criminal scum looking to get rich, live out their power mongering dreams, and being able to practice their perversions without fear of legal reprisal. Whether people like it or not they need to be active voters who do real research, and protest when corruption overtakes the election, and law making processes.

  9. Sodom and Gomorha all over again. What a mess the world will be when Jesus comes back. And children are not safe anymore, even from their own family members.

  10. He most certainly does have something in common with muslims. Neither are christians. And both insist everybody must follow their way of thinking. Or else…

  11. Judge Neilson himself may be a product of incest. In any case anyone who thinks like that certainly has a mental deficiency. Incest causes all sorts of problems, especially mental issues. Look no further than the muslim populations where incest is common.

  12. Good against Evil, guess what, Evil is winning by a rout as the heathen sheeple have become a stiff-necked people turning away from God and they are about to feel the pain and misery that comes with electing demonic leaders which are almost entirely made up with possessed demons on the Left – Obaa-baa-ma the “Dick-taker-N-Thief”, “Nancy the Nut” Pelosi, “Dirty” H.Reid, “Chucky” Shumer, Dianne “Fiend-stein”, “Hillory the Pillory” Clinton are just a handful of the demon possessed reprobates that are creating hell on earth as they destroy the last bastion of freedom, America and replacing it with “Hope & Change” which in reality is COMMUNISM – you useful idiots on the Left, just keep voting these monsters of disaster into POWER! REVOLUTION will be the SOLUTION!

    • Everything you say is true, but do want to point out that the reality is FASCISM, not COMMUNISM. Under Communism, working people really control the resources and their own working conditions – under Fascism the control is by an evil troika of plutocrats, government parasites, and the police.

  13. Well why the hell not. Since Obama opened the door for the closet people and had law officials stand down so illegals can step onto our soil, nothing can surprise me what Governments can and will do with little or no rebuttal. Just hope like hell Obama is not so demented that he would allow this morbid act to transpire here. But from everything else he did and (his term is still young) will do. I would not be surprised if he wanted this as a legacy as well.

  14. Once it starts, they will have their way…for seven years. Then, it’s OFFICIALLY game over for the degenerates.

  15. This whole world is going to hell. Perversity reigns and it would appear that Obama started it as pushing his muslim heritage, muslims being the scourge of the earth.. Anything goes. Good Lord, save us.

  16. Do you have a doubt that evil is loose in the world? Look at what obama and the Dems are inflicting upon us! If they can destroy AMERICA, they have conquered the world!!!! What a pity! Sadness reigns!

  17. my rather promiscuous pet cockatiel, alfalfa nymphicus, fell in love with a “socially active” prairie dog, polly morph, who used to come daily sniffin round his plastic cage. each time she did, his crest went north, so to speak, which then caused her to stand up and bark.

    they were quite a cute couple, but there was one problem: they were both under age, and their total combined expected life span was only 14 years.

    so we took them to a wise yet unorthodox justice of the peace, sol o. mann, a former attorney who had been disbarred for “commingling” tendencies. anyway, sol married (commingled) them, “in futuro”.

    sol assured us that meant al could have quiet enjoyment of polly for now, and she of him, but only in the future would they be legally able to kiss and “tell”, ie, publicly consent to the nasty. so for the time being, sol says, they are to remain “in flagrante dilecto”, kinda like friends with helen keller bennys.

    a shame, cause al had such a nice wedding ring all picked out for polly. now she must wait 3 years to don it on her small left paw.

  18. How much more does he think God will take from his sorry soul’s lack of morality? He has to be Godless.

      • The reason articles like this appear, is a demonstration of western civilizations adopting such things. Don’t forget, we are a western civilization that for some reason desperately wants to be like Europe and Australia.

        • Societies evolve. We haven’t caught up to the rest of the civilised world because we have too many Taliban in our midst. We’ll get there. Same-sex marriage is a perfect example: Oldsters can’t abide it, but the kids accept it. I counsel that we should embrace change, because it will happen with or without us.

          • Rape and murder happen and are the norm. But I won’t ever accept it. Just because something is the norm doesnt mean it is right. And im probablyhalf your on ttop of that

          • I was giving an example of what is right and wrong. And what I wil and won’t accept. Tolerate yes. But never accept

  19. Regarding incest….
    Consenting adults should be left alone to do what they wish in private. The First Commandment: ( and only one worth a hoot ) Let Thy Neighbor Alone …… 99guspuppet

  20. If it’s between two consenting adults then I do not care. There are many things people do in the bedroom that skeve me out. However again, as long as it’s between two consenting adults it does not matter. Unless you want the government constantly in your bedroom, deciding what you can and cannot do with a consenting adult partner.

    • No-not if they breed and ruin an innocent child’s life by creating deformities. And murder isn’t the answer either. Siblings don’t have sex period.

      • So you are saying that the government should be in every families home and bedrooms to make sure this doesn’t happen between any adult members of the family? And what if they aren’t breeding? Should the government be involved only if children are born from the process, but not before?

        • Murder doesn’t solve that problem-conducting ones self with a moral compass solves most problems if not all. But it would solve this problem. Who wants to engage their own sibling in marital relations? How sick do they have to be?

          • You say it’s murder. The law disagrees.

            If your cousin was a supermodel, she wanted you to do her, and you hadn’t had it for a while–well, those things have been going on in Redneck Country for centuries.

          • The law often says things that are diabolically wrong. In the Antebellum South, slaves were regarded no different from cattle, and the Supreme Court even decided that they were only three-fifths a person in the “Dred Scott decision.” In Nazi Germany, Jews were regarded under THEIR law as no different from disease-carrying rodents, or a diseases themselves that needed to be eradicated.

            Science and medicine disagrees with “the law.” When a pregnant women must have a medical procedure done, she is not the only patient, because the baby inside of her must be taken into consideration too. The unborn baby has its own set of genes and chromosomes, blood-type, and everything that will be who they are until their life comes to and end, either naturally or unnaturally. Only when someone applies completely subjective, arbitrary standards does the child somehow become something else.

          • So, change the law. There is a process by which you do that. It is called a constitutional amendment.

          • So long as there are so many who don’t “buy” what is true, but rather what is expedient, there never will be such a law. People do not even follow the letter of the Roe v. Wade decision, which makes exceptions for a fetuses’ “viability.” So, when you come right down to it, the law doesn’t matter because nobody enforces laws anymore, unless the persons breaking the law does not have influence within the authorities.

            We are headed down the wrong side of history, and I’d contend that we’ve already made it there. The reasons are many and varied, but to boil it all down to its essence, we are in the state we’re in because so many people aren’t “buying the snake oil” (as you put it) anymore. The choice this country had was to be ruled constitutionally, with laws that limited what a central authority could do to limit our unalienable, God-given freedoms and rights, or we could choose to be ruled by the whims of either the mob or an oligarchy. The the mob rules today, but they are becoming increasingly disenchanted with the continued lies and obfuscations that pour continually out of our federal government, and eventually the central authorities will deem it “necessary” to curb the constitution for good, and put their heel on our collective necks.

            Keep laughing, because unless you’re an elitist snob, you will be weeping with the rest of us soon enough.

          • John, if you think it was any different 200 years ago, you are ignorant of history. BushCo invented the yellowcake and WMD threat. LBJ fabricated the Gulf of Tonkin, and Abe Lincoln got the nickname “Spotty” because he was constantly questioning the supposed provocation for the Mexican-American War. They had their Teapot Domes, too.

            George Washington warned us about the grave dangers of faction. Thomas Jefferson predicted the judicial coup d’etat, and warned of the dangers of extreme inequality in wealth. None of this is new. The Constitution and Bill of Rights are a mere “parchment barrier,” and always have been. Judicial activism was as alive and well in the first Harlan’s era as it is today. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

          • I am not ignorant of history, since I have said earlier that politicians have only screwed this country up. You apparently either forgot that or missed it altogether.

            Yet, through all of the political corruption, the truly great Americans in our history have been those who were born nothings, and rose to prominence as could no other people anywhere, essentially because they weren’t burdened by elitist classes and despotic rule.

            And once again, we can choose a course where individual rights and liberties matter, or one where the whim of the moment takes precedence over everything and everyone. Politics as usual will always have sway, so long as ambiguities and ignorance reign in the hearts and minds of people.

          • Politicians and potentates have been screwing up our government from its inception. Politics was rougher in Jefferson’s day.

            America has become far more stratified by class than Europe. This is one inevitable effect of Reaganomics: ours is no longer a meritocracy. France does far better on that score.

          • Wow…it’s all due to “Reaganomics,” eh? Woodrow Wilson, Herbert Hoover, FDR, LBJ, Jimmy Carter, Bush 1 & 2, and Obama have NOTHING to do with it?

            If politics have softened today, it’s because there’s very little difference between the two parties. Republicans are Democrats who want to grow government, but want citizens to keep more of what they earn, while Democrats want to control all aspects of our lives, right down to what our lifestyles are, and what we think. Republicans are tyrannical, but Democrats are out-and-out dystopian.

            Benjamin Franklin is quoted to say, upon being asked what form of government that they had formed after the constitutional convention: “A republic, if you can keep it.” The farther we’ve gone from being a constitutional republic, the worse we’ve become for it, in all possible ways.

            We’ve gone from a national experiment to gauge whether people can govern themselves, which brought forth from undeveloped country such industry, invention, and entrepreneurial spirit that no other country had ever seen, to one that is stagnant, and in many areas in virtual ruin–because we weren’t able to keep our republic.

          • Chicago School economics dealt the death-blow to the American Experiment. You would have actually had to have read Adam Smith’s Wealth of Nations to understand why, but Rightards don’t read such highbrow texts.

          • Keynesian economics dealt the death-blow to our experiment of personal freedom and individual responsibility. The last time the United States had any unregulated, unbridled prosperity was after the reign of Woodrow Wilson, when Harding and Coolidge took America out of a crippling depression that began in 1920 (the last year of the Wilson administration), with unemployment as high as 11.7% in 1921, and had the economy running again, and unemployment as low as 2.4% by 1923. For a brief moment in time, capitalism and free enterprise was allowed to mesh with growing industry. Taxes across the board were lowered, and yet tax revenues increased (it always works that way–proving that increased revenues are not the purpose of progressive income taxes).

            After that, progressive Hoover threw laissez-faire capitalism into the dust-bin of history, he (and FDR) embraced John Maynard Keynes’ theories, and at least a dozen years of economic misery was the result. It has always amazed me that FDR was given credit for anything, besides exacerbating the problems started by Hoover, and prolonging a depression that the rest of the world worked out of LONG before we did. Had FDR followed the Harding/Coolidge path to prosperity, the US would have said good-bye to the depression long before it would have had a chance to become “Great.”

            Sadly, leftards long to repeat the same things over and over, claiming that they’ll eventually get different results. (Einstein’s definition of insanity)

          • If you think the American Experiment lasted three years in the Roaring 20s, you are not economically literate, and are begging not to be taken seriously.

          • As John Beam said, science says different. I’m jsut waiting for politicians and the American people to see science catch up with the law. Maybe not anytime soon, but hey. Evolution is taught as fact now and global warming caused by man seems to be sold as real. So, crazier things have happened I suppose, even when they are lies.

          • There is nothing we didn’t know in 1973. The reasoning for Roe is still sound. Evolution is the best explanation for how we got here, and our deleterious effect on the planet is established beyond cavil.

            Anyone who thinks that Job was real and global warming a hoax needs a freakin’ saliva test. Non compos mentis.

          • You can keep thinking abortion as a necessary evil and humans are the planets plague if you want. I personally wont burdening myself with self guilt for anything I or my ancestors have done.

          • Neither do I. Many of my ancestors didn’t even know what a Negro looked like. That having been said, all you need to do to understand why the other guy is mad is try to put yourself in his shoes for a moment.

          • The arc of history bends toward justice, but it doesn’t get there in a smooth and elegant manner.

            JB: “the Supreme Court even decided that they were only three-fifths a person in the “Dred Scott decision.”

            Actually, the three-fifths was written into the Constitution itself and used to determine representation in the House. What Scott v. Sandford held was that “property” did not have standing to sue, and that by entering a free state, property did not cease to be property. Bizarre, but also quite Biblical.

            JB: Science and medicine disagrees with “the law.”

            There is nothing we didn’t already know in 1973. Roe is sound law, mostly because the State does not have any legitimate interest in whether a particular woman carries a particular fetus to term. And that should not change.

          • The three-fifths clause was a compromise in order to lessen the influence of the slave states. The Southern states wanted them to be FULLY counted for representation. But regardless, it was enforced law that was and is reprehensible, and only changed when people of Christian principles demanded its abolition. BTW, Slavery still exists in Arab Muslim countries–you know, the people who lefty progressives almost always fall on the side of–and, before you get your knee-jerk impulses into a fever-pitch, Bush is a PROGRESSIVE. Most Republicans are. Government exploded under his administration, only to be dwarfed by the current one.

            “There is nothing we didn’t already know in 1973. Roe is sound law, mostly because the State does not have any legitimate interest in whether a particular woman carries a particular fetus to term. And that should not change.”

            So, human life does not matter? A law that legitimizes taking the life of another human being is “sound”? Really? I’ll bet you use “science” constantly in order to refute people you disagree with, but NOW if someone wants to call a human being an inconvenient “blob of cells,” you are willing to throw it out the window? I guess you only care about science and medicine when it’s politically expedient.

          • Asked and answered elsewhere. No right is absolute. I’m not denying science in reaching that conclusion, whereas you deny it with respect to evolution and global warming.

            B: “But regardless, it was enforced law that was and is reprehensible, and only changed when people of Christian principles demanded its abolition.

            People of Christian principles exploited the slave trade, and used the Bible in justification of it. Basically, it was deists like Jefferson who found it repugnant, as well as Northerners who didn’t have much use for them.

          • Your denial rings hollow, since you obviously believe that a homosexual’s right to cause another person to reject his conscious and faith is absolute. You also believe that a woman who wishes to kill her child at any point during gestation (even to the day which it will be naturally born) is absolute. Rights aren’t absolute unless it follows your partisan agenda. Moreover, your partisan political expediency is absolute.

            Regarding Christian principles, they have nothing to do with enslaving other human beings. We are to love our neighbors as ourselves, and even those who react hatefully towards us. Christianity is behaving as Christ would, as is recorded in the gospels. People who call themselves Christian, and do the opposite of what Christ taught cannot be Christian.

            It logically cannot follow that someone who says he’s something, but does not do what he says that he does IS that which he calls himself. If, for example, a man calls himself a physician, but he has never taken a single class in medicine, and instead he’s a disreputable brute who puts OTHER PEOPLE into the hospital because he injures them, would people identify him as “doctor,” or as a worthless scoundrel? Also, should this supposed “doctor’s” behavior harm the reputation of actual doctors, simply because the worthless scoundrel calls himself “doctor”?

            Regarding Jefferson’s “deism”, here are a few quotes from him that expresses his beliefs:

            “God who gave us life gave us liberty. And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the Gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath? Indeed, I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that His justice cannot sleep forever; That a revolution of the wheel of fortune, a change of situation, is among possible events; that it may become probable by Supernatural influence! The Almighty has no attribute which can take side with us in that event.”
            –Notes on the State of Virginia, Query XVIII, p. 237.

            “I am a real Christian – that is to say, a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus Christ.”
            –The Writings of Thomas Jefferson, p. 385.

            These do not sound “deist” to me.

            Also, here’s some quotes by Ben Franklin, another supposed “deist”:

            “Here is my Creed. I believe in one God, the Creator of the Universe. That He governs it by His Providence. That He ought to be worshipped.

            “That the most acceptable service we render to him is in doing good to his other children. That the soul of man is immortal, and will be treated with justice in another life respecting its conduct in this. These I take to be the fundamental points in all sound religion, and I regard them as you do in whatever sect I meet with them.

            “As to Jesus of Nazareth, my opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the system of morals and his religion, as he left them to us, is the best the world ever saw, or is likely to see;

            “But I apprehend it has received various corrupting changes, and I have, with most of the present dissenters in England, some doubts as to his divinity; though it is a question I do not dogmatize upon, having never studied it, and think it needless to busy myself with it now, when I expect soon an opportunity of knowing the truth with less trouble. I see no harm, however, in its being believed, if that belief has the good consequence, as probably it has, of making his doctrines more respected and more observed; especially as I do not perceive, that the Supreme takes it amiss, by distinguishing the unbelievers in his government of the world with any peculiar marks of his displeasure.”

            Ben doesn’t particularly identify as “Christian” here; however, note that his regard of Christ Jesus is quite high, and his “system of morals… is the best the world ever saw, or is likely to see”. So, what I see here is that Mr. Franklin acknowledged God’s existence, that this God is interconnected with the affairs of men, that he should be worshiped, and moreover there is no better “moral system” than what was left to us by Jesus.

            With regard to denying evolution (I presuppose that you mean Darwinian evolution) and global warming, I will be brief. Micro-evolution is indeed factual, whereas, macro-evolution is unfounded and assumptive. The appearing of a self-producing organism, with all of the necessary chemical combinations of amino acids to form the proteins necessary to live out of a non-living “primordial ooze” has nothing whatsoever to do with any sort of “scientific method.” Furthermore, the becoming of a sponge into a vertebrate, due to the magical ingredient of time, is also outside the scope of the scientific method. Both are absurd.

            Regarding global warming, I do not assume to know whether scientists have proof of it, because I know that many scientists are agenda-driven, rather than truth-driven. I also know that “scientific consensus” isn’t scientific. I also believe that it is ridiculous to believe that IF global warming is occurring, that human activity has had anything to do with it. Warming and cooling periods have occurred throughout the earth’s existence. If we’re in a warming trend, then we’re in a warming trend. So what? To you progressives, it’s a diabolical heresy not to be alarmed by seasonal warmness.

          • It’s called “the rule of law,” JB. If a state passes a law saying that you can’t discriminate against gays if you open your business to the public, they kind-of have a right to do that.

            As for abortion, I can think of reasons why an abortion might be performed in the seventh month, such as what happened to the Santorums. If Karen S carried the fetus to term–it was anencephalic–it would die within a day (it did). The option was abortion, and it would have been a safer one, according to the docs at Walter Reed. While I would have no problem with you making the call to carry it to term, you have NO GODDAMNED F****** RIGHT to demand that another woman take that risk. Capeesh?

            JB: “People who call themselves Christian, and do the opposite of what Christ taught cannot be Christian.

            Which means you could hold a national convention of Christians in a VW microbus.

            JB: “[Jefferson] “I am a real Christian – that is to say, a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus Christ.”

            Ever read the Jefferson Bible? The doctrines that he attributed to Jesus were essentially deist.

            JB: ““As to Jesus of Nazareth, my opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the system of morals and his religion, as he left them to us, is the best the world ever saw, or is likely to see;

            “But I apprehend it has received various corrupting changes, and I have, with most of the present dissenters in England, some doubts as to his divinity;

            Exceptionally deist. Wonder why I use the moniker, “dissenter”? If you start with Matt. 7:12 and keep anything consistent with it, you don’t have anything that looks like modern Christianity, but was part and parcel of the deistic heresies of the day. R. Yeshua was a man, and nothing more.

            JB: “ The appearing of a self-producing organism, with all of the necessary chemical combinations of amino acids to form the proteins necessary to live out of a non-living “primordial ooze” has nothing whatsoever to do with any sort of “scientific method.”

            Sidney Fox. Proteinoid microspheres. While the trail from lifelessness to life is undoubtedly an arduous one, the first steps on the trail are well-marked.

            JB: “Regarding global warming, I do not assume to know whether scientists have proof of it, because I know that many scientists are agenda-driven, rather than truth-driven.

            You sound like you’ve been listening to the modern tobacco whorrrres owned by the Koch brothers. Even their whorrrrres are capitulating on the basis of the evidence: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/richard-muller-koch-brothers-funded-scientist-declares-global-warming-real-article-1.969870

            I knew about Sagan’s thesis in the ’70s, while taking advanced astronomy courses. This was understood by those who studied these sort of things back then. Not only is it proven, but thanks to you ostriches, our children are going to be screwed royally, if humanity even survives. I observed back then that you religious droolers would kill the planet, and unfortunately, I am likely to be prescient.

          • How does the rule of law exist when you dredge up laws that erodes the focus upon the rule of law? How can you have the “rule of law” when you create laws that put the power of the state over the constitutional religious conscious of citizens? People should be able to have the right of association, and this sort of business occurs constantly, without people going to court and suing them.

            The fact of the matter is that this insane notion that sexual deviancy should be embraced and regarded as normal as falling off a log is a brand-new phenomenon in the world, and it doesn’t surprise me that it coincides with the better part of the world committing virtual suicide–with regard to national demographics, where you “enlightened types” are aborting your children, birth rates in all “Western Democracies” have dropped to a point where their national cultures will be unable to sustain themselves, but you will be replaced by the worst possible people imaginable. You have this idea of an atheist Utopia, but that will be impossible because you leave no progeny, and by the time the Muslims take over (because they are breeding like rabbits), atheism will cease to exist, because they will either force you to accept Islam, or you will literally lose your heads.

            Regarding abortions, there are situations where taking the baby because it simply makes sense to not carry it to term is totally reasonable. I am not unreasonable regarding that, and frankly it’s ridiculous of you to assume that I or anyone else cannot be reasonable about it. However, when will the “pro-choice” pagan Taliban decide to be reasonable? When will the obvious barbarity of “partial-birth-abortions”, where you take a perfectly normal and healthy baby that is practically ready to be born, and you remove it from the vaginal canal except for the head, where you open the back of the head with scissors, and vacuum out the baby’s brain, be seen as for what it is? You scream about being reasonable about allowing abortions, but are you willing to positioning yourself to protect the life of a child that could easily survive outside of the womb? You called Roe v. Wade sound, but the whole viability issue has been scrapped, as though it had nothing to do with the ruling. If viability doesn’t matter, then does that effect your attitude towards it?

            “Which means you could hold a national convention of Christians in a VW microbus.”

            This is absurd, but even if it is true, it still would be scriptural. It is claimed that roughly one-fifth to a quarter of the earth’s population is “Christian,” but Christ said that few would enter into the kingdom of heaven. However, your assumption that people cannot live in accordance to the words of Christ is utterly absurd, and only speaks towards your inexperience and disdain towards Christians. BTW, why are you so irrationally discriminatory towards Christians?

            Regarding Franklin, how does his belief in one God, that he created and governs the universe, and that he should be worshiped count as being “deist”? Deists believe in God, but they do not believe that he intervenes in creation, and he does not make himself known to his creation, whereas Franklin says that God is one, he governs the universe, and that it is important that we worship him. That goes well-beyond one’s “deism.”

            But, regardless of this, the abolition movement in America was in its essence a Christian endeavor, it was very unpopular in both the North and South, and it only gained traction after the Emancipation Proclamation. Any denial of this fact flies in the face of history.

            Regarding global warming, what evidence are you talking about? Only 30 years ago “science” told everyone that the world was heading into another ice age. Global warming doomsday prophets predicted crap ten years ago that by now we were all supposed to be drowning from the ice caps melting. It’s called WEATHER. GET OVER IT. Nature just doing what it does naturally produces more CO2 and greenhouse gases in one enormous volcanic eruption than humans have done since the industrial revolution. What did people “do” to create global warming BEFORE the industrial revolution to create global warming (such as what happened after the “little ice age” of between 1350 to about 1850?

            The whole idea of blaming human activity for the weather, and that if we don’t stop the wheels of industry and economic progress, that we’ll destroy the earth is infantile. The United States does not create nearly as much pollution as China, but who is telling China to stop destroying the earth? Who is telling anyone ELSE to stop destroying the earth, besides the United States? The entire narrative of this stupidity is to give leftists who are already predetermined to blame America for all of the world’s ills even more of a reason to thrust more guilt and victimization into our faces.

            Your weeping about the unlikely prospects of human survival is pathetic. As I’ve said before, you are killing your own progeny, the whole of “enlightened” Europe is going to be swallowed up by Middle Eastern and North African Muslims, who are NEVER considered a threat by progressives–in fact, whenever they run amok and slaughter innocent people, you guys ALWAYS rush to their defense, claiming that “NOT ALL MUSLIMS DO IT, ONLY A FEW!” Well, if you witness the end of humanity, it will be the fault of you geniuses exercising your sexual and reproductive rights, and joining arm-in-arm with crazed maniacs who view atheists the same as polytheists (in other words, they want to kill you).

          • JB: “How can you have the “rule of law” when you create laws that put the power of the state over the constitutional religious conscious of citizens?

            Justice Scalia–yeah, THAT Justice Scalia–responds:

            We have never held that an individual’s religious beliefs excuse him from compliance with an otherwise valid law prohibiting conduct that the State is free to regulate. On the contrary, the record of more than a century of our free exercise jurisprudence contradicts that proposition. As described succinctly by Justice Frankfurter in Minersville School Dist. Bd. of Ed. v. Gobitis, 310 U. S. 586, 594-595 (1940): “Conscientious scruples have not, in the course of the long struggle for religious toleration, relieved the individual from obedience to a general law not aimed at the promotion or restriction of religious beliefs. The mere possession of religious convictions which contradict the relevant concerns of a political society does not relieve the citizen from the discharge of political responsibilities (footnote omitted).” We first had occasion to assert that principle in Reynolds v. United States, 98 U. S. 145 (1879), where we rejected the claim that criminal laws against polygamy could not be constitutionally applied to those whose religion commanded the practice. “Laws,” we said, “are made for the government of actions, and while they cannot interfere with mere religious belief and opinions, they may with practices. . . . Can a man excuse his practices to the contrary because of his religious belief? To permit this would be to make the professed doctrines of religious belief superior to the law of the land, and in effect to permit every citizen to become a law unto himself.” Id., at 166-167.

            I do have his home mailing address, should you like to take it up with him personally.

            JB: “ you will be replaced by the worst possible people imaginable. You have this idea of an atheist Utopia, but that will be impossible because you leave no progeny, and by the time the Muslims take over (because they are breeding like rabbits),

            You mean Catholics, right? Talk about banging out bambinos….

            But think about it: If I have no progeny, why would I care about the coming sh*tstorm?

            JB: “ It’s called WEATHER. GET OVER IT. Nature just doing what it does naturally produces more CO2 and greenhouse gases in one enormous volcanic eruption than humans have done since the industrial revolution.

            Actually, we can account for all of the human-produced CO2. It either ended up in the oceans–which act as a filter, but it is now a “dirty” one (acidification, stressing the food chain)–or in the atmosphere. As the oceans are now at capacity (saturation point), it has nowhere else to go but the atmosphere.

            It’s all the kind of hard science you didn’t learn in your madrassa. Astrophysicists knew this back in the ’70s, when we studied things like Sagan’s graduate thesis. Weather is what happens today; climate is long-term. Your ignorance and inattentiveness is incurable, or so it would seem. Let your progeny despise you for your stubbornness….

            JB: “Regarding Franklin, how does his belief in one God, that he created and governs the universe, and that he should be worshiped count as being “deist”?

            Deism evolved over the centuries, much as Christianity has. Folks worked through the logical inconsistencies.

            The only difference between you religious froot-loops and the Taliban is that they have more power in their society.

  21. The offspring are often deaf and can’t speak. Some are crippled. Some disfigurements are what we would often see in the old health books. Go to the library and look it up yourself. Inbreeding is not good for man nor beast.

  22. I am an advocate of hetero-normativity—that all means of homosexuality is unhealthy and non-Biblical. I also feel that the practice of all homosexual activities, have a great role in the decadence of America as well as the practice of them has a large responsibility of them has caused most of our social disruptions.

  23. Well when this judge dies he will give an accounting before the Lord. Every word of his mouth will be judged. Incest is an abomination before God as is these other sexual sins he defends. In May of 1985 I stood before Jesus and a outer body experience and He was merciful and when I felt the presence of God the Father it was more powerful than you can possibly imagine. Save yourself and give yourself to Jesus and He will save you from this fallen and perverse world.

        • And he would be held blameless. He swore an oath to apply the law of the land to the facts of each case, even when he might personally find the outcome repulsive. He is a far better judge than Antonin Scalia, who routinely constitutionalizes his personal preferences.

          • No he would not be held blameless before God for this ruling in favor of incest. God’s law is above every human law. As a matter of fact in the book of Revelation Jesus said ” Do not follow the ways of your leaders who do not know God” This is God’s permission to me to disobey any immoral law on earth against God’s law.

          • Justice Scalia responds:

            Judicial decisions, like the Constitution itself, are nothing more than “parchment barriers,” 5 Writings of James Madison 269, 272 (G. Hunt ed. 1901). Both depend on a judicial culture that understands its constitutionally assigned role, has the courage to persist in that role when it means announcing unpopular decisions, and has the modesty to persist when it produces results that go against the judges’ policy preferences.

            There was a reported exchange between Justice Holmes and Learned Hand, where Hand beseeched Holmes to “do justice.” Holmes replied: “That is not my job. My job is to apply the law.”

            You can take your Qu’ran and do whatever with it.

          • Wow, You can tell the difference between the bible and Koran. You spelled Koran wrong and who mentioned the Koran? Either way incest is a sin that will lead one who commits it to lose their soul if they do not repent. Incest is an abomination before God. Only a pervert would endorse a another pervert like this judge.

  24. And as the Demacrat Senator of Mississippi or Louisiana, one of those southern states said “if a man loves his mule and his mule loves him, I see nothing wrong with them getting married, as long as they both love one another.” Yes sad but true.

      • But, under new law our military troops are legally able to have sex with animals. Do you approve of that then? Since you adhere to the law so well, and the courts are our gods.

          • You didnt answer the question. And if the law doesnt apply consent, then it can’t be called rape when it is legal. Hence my point of legal bestiality with our soldiers. Just like how you state abortion isnt murder when the law doesnt say so even though science does.

          • You are saying, hypothetically, that we passed a law in Wyoming (where it would actually be plausible) that let men rape sheep. Jewish law actually declared the rape of a two-year-old girl to be no harm, no foul back in Jesus’s day, so this isn’t entirely hypothetical.

            Whether I approve or not is immaterial. It is either legal, or it is not. And if it is legal, I don’t really have much of a say.

            Science can’t say that abortion is murder, as murder is a legal judgment. I explained elsewhere that no right is absolute, and why your proposal would be problematic.

  25. When man makes the rules the only thing certain is that the rules will always change. Societal morality grounded in man has all the stability of very wet quicksand.

  26. Based on that line of thinking its okay to rape a sexually experienced woman who is currently unattached to a man and therefore sexually available — regardless of whether she made it clear she does NOT want sex. And this is justified because we no longer live in the 1950’s??? We are not evolving as a species we are devolving and rapidly. What’s his stance on sex with dead judges — aka Necrophilia Justice? After all this is the 21st. century.

  27. Is this a judge, or the devils advocate? Death is too quick and gentle for such perversions to be in a judges mind.

  28. What the judge seem to forget is he raped his sister when he was 18-19 and she was 10-11 years old. Also not mentioned was weather he continued to rape her until she was 18 and he was 26. The rape of a child by her brother is reason enough to put him away for lfe. I don’t care if they had sex when she was legal , her mind and ability to protect herself was stripped from her at 10 years old and would have further eroded if he continued to rape her throughout her childhood. In many cases she would believe it was alright now and most likely her fault.
    Stockholm syndrome comes to mind.
    Unless you have lived with someone who has undergone this kind of devastation it is hard for most to understand the damage that goes on for life.
    This Judge needs to go back and get some more training on this subject so in the future he doesn’t write such an asinine ruling. Take a close look at your children at that age and imagine this being dumped on their shoulders and what you would do!

    • times two wrote; “This Judge needs to go back and get some more training on this subject so in the future he doesn’t write such an asinine ruling.”
      He lacks the moral insight now, so its too late to instill it within his perverse mind. His heart is already black & withered so any future rulings should be made by someone else. He needs to be removed and placed under psychiatric care for his deviant views.

      • You are probably right as to the judge being done, but judges are rarely removed from the bench just look at the 9th district court of appeals in California.
        The only thing that may work is by applying enough publicity world wide to shame his boss to pull the plug.
        This is not at all unique judges, police, teachers social workers and family members have been turning a blind eye or even worse calling kids that report this abuse liars.
        1 in 4 women are sexually molested by age 18 a large number by family
        We just need to keep the pressure on .

          • Actually sexual child abuse is world wide and the Bible belt is no more likely than anywhere else in the country. It happens in the richest of families and the poorest where a brother would rape his sister. A judge in New York City is just as likely to molest his daughter as somebody you would call a redneck.
            Incest is one of the most damaging and cruel things a father, stepfather, uncle , brother can do. To name a few non rednecks Stan Kenton the jazz great molested his daughter as did Sigmund Freud.One of the most heinous I have ever have known was a Extremely well respected Doctor Who ever body praised almost to the point of being a God sexually molested his daughter his granddaughters and their daughters as well. And these people are far from being rednecks. The sad fact is you can be anywhere and a child molester can be sitting next to you

          • I have exactly no time or sympathy for any adult who forces himself on a child. Period. But it was common in the backwoods, mostly because sisters and cousins were all that was handy.

  29. I say lets reopen the closets in America and stuff the homosexuals back inside and lock the doors. We tried being fair and understanding and that has only opened the flood gates of sexual perversion. Enough already.

  30. From some of the comments, I really want to point out that perversion is NOT particular to just liberals. Case in point: the Bohemian Grove gatherings where the world’s most wealthy and powerful frolic nude thru the redwoods in a strange homosexual sex ritual.

  31. Well just another step in the downward spiral of humanity. The open depravity of our species is staggering. He can marry him, she can marry her and now some wacked out judge claims that incest is no longer a problem either. How long before a similar ruling is made concerning pedophilia??. Then of course we have abortion running absolutely out of control. According to the abortion clock, globally we have murdered 1.3 Billion innocents since 1970, and in the U.S., 6.8 million during the same time period with over 1000 just today. Now add to that the complete loss of morality in general, soaring murder rates, theft and plunder nearly everywhere one looks, politicians who lie, cheat, and steal as a way of life, millions who refuse to care for themselves becoming warts on the buttocks of the larger society, religion primarily (Christians and Jews) under constant attack.
    The global community has become one large cesspool of depravity. Could anyone fault the Almighty for doing to us what was done to Sodom and Gamorrah.
    Perhaps we are nearing our time for extinction. Besides at the rate technology is growing, humans will likely be replaced with electronic versions anyway.
    More proof the world that millions of us were born into actually died some time ago!

  32. Has the Judge’s mother been “sexually awoken” by His uncles and aunts yet? That’s the real question.

  33. Sick freaking b^stard! ANY judge that allows this no matter where they are or what country should be removed from the bench for life and tarred and feathered

  34. There was already a case where a man married his goat so bestiality is already ok in one Nation. Since the IDIOTS of this world have opened the door of the Perverted and DISGUSTING sex acts. Things like this arte only get allowed in more Nations as time goes by and yes that will Include Pedophilia. Soon even forced sex(rape)will be legal. Now that the perverse life style CHOICE of Homosexuality has been made Legal all the other perverts in this world will demand they get their way and to try and stop them will be called HATE as Homosexuals are trying to get made of Christian speech. GOD will and is Taking America to task for allowing the bible to be thrown out of everywhere and then the MURDER of the UNBORN, Now it is all forms of sexual perversion man can think up. America is DYING and the only thing to be decided is how long the death will take. Christ said this type of Sexual Perversion and HATRED of Christians would happen and it will be a sign the end is Near. To which I say EVEN SO COME QUICKLY,LORD JESUS.

  35. This did happen quite some years ago in the State of SOUTH AUSTRALIA, well known for it’s often perverse ideas and laws. We can see that, as it is Australia’s POOREST STATE, that it seems to have a CURSE running with it! Actually, If you read your COMMANMENTS in Exodus 20, note particularly the SECOND (2nd.) Law…. which mentions curses as a result of the Hatred for God (Meaning the effect of dis-respect. dis-honour, dis-belief, and dis-obedience of God’s Laws)… It really shows that any behavioural and legal support of sin, will leave effects down to 4th generations of those places that still “Hate” God… remember, to LOVE GOD (respect, honour, believe, obey HIM) brings health and decent living conditions, plus it allows us to DO whatever He warns us of, without fail, meaning He can save us from calamities physically by our own OBEDIENCE, whereas those who disobey and disbelieve Him would not follow at all and suffer the consequences: Jesus drew this conclusionfor us when mentioning “just as in the days of Noah”. So, being SAVED has not only spiritual effects, but physical also. And we cannot be SAVED without OBEDIENCE to God and Jesus (who each taught the very same thing in different terminology)… and THAT and other scripture REQUIRES a primary obedience: First THE LAW as it stands.. not the myriads of laws written by Levites which beacame a BURDEN LIKE A MILLSTONE AROUND PEOPLES NECKS… but an individually symbolic and physical expression of LOVE for God and THE CHRIST…. WITHOUT that pre-requisite, we are not His people YET, and will not UNDERSTAND HIS WAYS! And so, the superficial attendees of churches sin against God again, by supporting SINFUL BILLS AND LAWS through their VOTES, which brings about a NATIONAL CHAOS of sin and lust promotion through legalisation.

    • Problem is, the judge is in NSW, which includes Sydney. So much for the theory that SA suffers from a curse….

  36. I will agree with him when he produces irrefutable proof that he has taken it in the back door from a kangaroo, a wallaby and a buffalo.

  37. That one was coming….. Homosexuals adopt little boys, and this will occur… Example Harvey Milk SF city council was known for molesting boys, and was still elected….. 98% of child molesters that molest little boys are in fact Homosexuals

  38. This man is a JUDGE? He does not understand biology and the problems of intermarrying. He does not understand the psychological problems of a girl who has been manipulated and abused, not being able to turn away his advances. He does not believe that God knows anything.
    This judge, once again, should be removed. He has proven that he is NOTHING but an animal.

  39. I’ve been telling people this is coming too; it’s not rocket science! Once you accept one perversion as “okay”, you have NO moral ground on which to reject any. And that’s exactly where we, as a society, are. As a Christian and a survivor of childhood incestuous abuse by 3adults in my family, I know all too well the harm this does to children, and it’s happening in our schools, under the guise of “sex ed”! But people are so busy being “PC tolerant” , lest the be called a name, they can’t or won’t hear the truth any longer! They would rather allow their kids to be screwed up for life!

  40. Young girls who are raped are far more likely to subsequently engage in “consensual” sex at younger ages than girls who were not raped. The judge’s logic that it was acceptable for the brother to be attracted to his sister because she had engaged in sex with other men misses a very important point. The brother is the one who sexualized his sister at a young age and later is allowed to use her sexualization as a defense for his later relations with her.

      • That’s not unusual, if you really watch these so called Liberal Progressives, you’ll find them far more regressive, than progressive. Our Constitution, and Bill of Rights, is still one of the most Liberating documents ever produced. Raising the Rights of the Individual, on par with the Government, yet they urn for the days when Government lorded over all.

  41. You Christians are going to find it hard to say that the judge is entirely wrong here. After all, it is consensual sex between a man and a woman….

  42. I couldn’t believe what I was reading. Have we as a Society degraded this far? Obviously to some people we have.
    Another unfortunate thing is for this official to muse these, to him realistic words on this matter gives another excuse to and lends credance for this abhorrent behavior. The societal ‘detrimental assaults’ by the Leftist Gay and Lesbian organizations, has severely damaged Society and the Laws put forth by the majority of morality based people. Those that ignore History tend to repeat it. Remember ‘SODOM’ and that lesson? Are we to follow along that path? Unless We the PEOPLE stop this progression down that proverbial ‘Slippery Slope’, we will all suffer the same fate. This is why we MUST know for whom we Vote ! Don’t vote for “X” because someone told you to. Know that Candidate and his ethics and political bent. Quo vadis? “Si vis pacem, para bellum !” = ‘ If you want peace, prepare for War !’ ~Rick Magee, “MOLON LABE”

  43. For those who believe on Jesus :
    Jesus would not have advocated violence. Jesus would not have advocated force or coercion. Jesus would not have advocated hate. Christians achieve success on earth by becoming a role model based on Jesus and by achieving inner peace. Not by wishing others to burn in hell. 99guspuppet

    • Baloney. You need to re-read the New Testament. Your notion of Christianity is a charicature.

      1. When Jesus sent his disciples into a godless world, He told them to sell their garment and buy a sword. So one can safely assume that while He He didn’t tell them to convert by the sword, He permitted them to defend themselves with it.

      . The Apostle Paul wrote that every man who didn’t provide for his own family is worse than an unbeliever. A family needs food, shelter, clothing, love, discipline and security. So, defense of family, neighbor, country is also permitted…..or as what might have happened in WW2 had everyone adapted to your errant mystical beliefs, we would all now be speaking German.

      Christianity does NOT teach pacifism, Pacifists are nothing more than selfish parasites on the backs of the courageous who are willing to pay the ultimate price to secure liberty.

      2. The Christian doesn’t ”achieve inner peace”’. He already has it. Any bible believer should know this.

      Rom 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

      Php 4:7 And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.

      Peace is a fruit of the Spirit….something that comes with our submission to the Holy Spirit, not something we ”achieve” by our own efforts. It comes with putting aside ourselves and submitting to God and His will. His purpose becomes our purpose.

      Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

      Col 3:15 And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful.

      3. As for ”wishing others to burn in hell”……You have a problem. Jesus himself taught more on hell than He did on heaven. He called out sin where He saw it and warned people what the cost would be if they rejected Him. That was not ”wishing” people to hell, but a simple statement of fact.

      He said:

      Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

      Mat 23:33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

      Mat 13:41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

      Mat 13:42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

      Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

      4. While we ought not go looking for a fight, we won’t run from one either.

      Rom 12:18 If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.

      If our character is assaulted, if we are robbed and plundered, if we are oppressed contrary to the law of the land, our faith does not require us to submit to such oppression and injury. To become a Christian does not mean then that we are to simply acquiesce to the wicked and abandon our rights under the law. Your notion of a milquetoast Christian is not in the Bible.

  44. If I were by chance to be judged by Jesus … I would be content that my beliefs would be acceptable to Jesus…. I am not a pacifist ….. Jesus would have said…”Let thy neighbor alone” …. I do not cherry-pick scriptures to find support for what I want to do anyway …. as do some.

  45. Did anyone notice how perversity multiplies perversity? What about the part where this guys says;

    “…If this was the 1950s and you had a jury of 12 men there, which is what you’d invariably have, they would say it’s unnatural for a man to be interested in another man or a man being interested IN A BOY. Those things have gone.”

    This is only the beginning, folks – only the beginning.

  46. At one time in the scriptures of the old testament, incest was culture among the seed of Abraham, as the edict to do so came from God Himself. Even Abraham’s wife (Sarah) was his half sister. Later on, God said no more. In the arena of relationships among consenting adults, incest is certainly not a “new thing”. Like homosexuality, it has been here about as long. Inbreeding among humans, as well as animals makes the off-spring physically inferior, unhealthy, and prone to many kinds of health conditions, including being hemophiliac. Ultimately, it comes down to what the individual shall choose to do, based on their religious convictions, philosophy on life, etc. However incest among consenting adults can be rightly banned, because of the harm bred into a human that is born out of such unions. Final note: it is one thing to argue what the Bible says, it’s something altogether different to encode that into law, that will subject everyone that does not embrace scripture as their beliefs.

  47. One sin leads to another. If they make one ok, why not a free for all! They won’t stop in aiding the way to hell. they have no moral ground, no compass, no center, no foundation.If they have any beliefs at all it is that they came from a big bang or some amoeba (animal) therefore they have the brain and behavior of such.

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